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Apr 26 08 10:07 AM

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It happened in 2000. An irish man, his name is Ciaran Tobin, driving his car as a mad on the pavement, killed two children in Hungary. Before the hungarian court sentenced him, he left our country, went back to Ireland, and does not want to go to jail.
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#5 [url]

Apr 28 08 11:52 AM

I am not a lawyer, just angry, because this man killed two innocent children from my nation.

I do not want to put him behind bars now. I only want all his neighborhood, all his relatives, all his friends, all his colleges to know:

Ciaran Tobin killed two children, driving his car like a mad on the pavement, his pregnant wife sitting next to him. As far as I know, he has his driving license, and drives day by day in the streets of Ireland.

Do you have children, dear reader?

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#7 [url]

Apr 28 08 9:59 PM

Füle Sándor wrote:
I am not a lawyer, just angry, because this man killed two innocent children from my nation.

I do not want to put him behind bars now. I only want all his neighborhood, all his relatives, all his friends, all his colleges to know:

Ciaran Tobin killed two children, driving his car like a mad on the pavement, his pregnant wife sitting next to him. As far as I know, he has his driving license, and drives day by day in the streets of Ireland.

Do you have children, dear reader?



Has the Hungarian government sought to extradite him?

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#8 [url]

Apr 29 08 3:47 AM

Yes. However, I learned in the last few days that the correct word is not extradite but surrender. Extradition is a diplomatic act between two countres in general. This specific procedure is based on the European Arrest Warrant framework, which should be normally faster and easier then an extradition procedure. The guy has final judgement in Hungary after a long and fair legal procedure. He should serve for his crime. But the Irish court refused to surrender him argueing about irrelevant linguistic questions.

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Kat

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#9 [url]

Apr 29 08 4:07 AM

Welcome to the Hungarian contingent to this forum.

Guten Morgen, Firstly may I say, I am sorry for the tragic loss of these youths, sadly the vagaries of international law make the prosecution and even investigation of these tragic accidents very difficult. This does not make them any less horrible though, and likely makes them much harder to heal from or to accept. What I can say though, if this helps at all... often when crimes of a premeditatated or purposeful nature are commited it is easier for loved ones to find justice internationially, perhaps the accidental nature of this horrible accident, while sadly preventing justice in the form of punishment for the driver, can be of some solace, to those left to grieve the loss of the children..

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#10 [url]

Apr 30 08 5:03 AM

Bon jour! Thank you for your words and greetings for you all.

There is a Wikipedia article about the case:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciaran_Tobin_extradition_case

You may ask why we say always "crime" and not "accident" or "mistake". Here is the answer:

"It was an accident", some may say. Right. Let's see. According to witnesses, Ciaran Tobin had been, at the time of the "accident", speeding recklessly for a good 20-30 minutes coming back from Visegrád to Budapest, in bumper-to-bumper traffic, on a two-lane road, through mostly residential neighbourhoods, enjoying his fast car, overtaking constantly using both the left lane and the shoulder (!) on the right. All the while, his pregnant wife sitting next to him.

When inside the picturesque village of Leányfalu, at a bus stop outside the library, he ventured out in the left lane again, one too many times. Bad judgement of speed, time and space and an upcoming car. And his own abilities.

According to court papers the car was moving at 70-85 km/h at the time of the impact. After hitting and knocking down two traffic signs, one a speed limit, the other one a pedestrian's crossing, that is.

Marci was standing in the middle of the sidewalk, Petra sitting in a pram, waiting to cross on the Zebra. They were thrown away some 10 meters, and the Volvo only stopped on hitting a bus.

Parents, who lived nearby, were called on the phone, and ran to the scene. Paramedics were helpless. Marci and Petra died instantly. They were pronounced dead by the doctor of the helicopter ambulance.

According to court papers, although Tobin variably claimed a technical failure of the car, experts established there was nothing wrong with the Volvo S40.

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#12 [url]

Apr 30 08 4:29 PM

I had never heard of this until reading it here. Thanks members.

I do have three questions:

1. Did the police arrest him immediately after the accident? (Sorry, I'm used to calling most vehicle events as "accidents") It seems like an arrest for vehicular manslaughter would be called for, with prompt incarceration.

2. Was the Irish Embassy aware of the deaths/ event?

3. Is it common for a government to allow someone charged with a crime, especially one as serious as this, to exit the country in exchange for a small cash deposit?

This whole story is just sad. My heart goes out to the parents of Márton and Petra.

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#13 [url]

Apr 30 08 6:45 PM

Hi and thanks for your attention...

Good questions. Everybody asks the same and similar questions.

1. No, he was not arrested. The legal acrobatics began already on the day of the "accident".

2. I only assume that the Irish Embassy must have been well informed.

3. No, it's not common, it's suspicious.

Citation from the site www.ciaran-tobin.com :

"The case highlights Hungarian incompetency, Irish embarrassment, legal and linguistic acrobatics, and EU's ineffectiveness." So, we know that there were a lot of mistakes on the Hungarian side as well. But after all there is a sentence by the court.

For more details please visit the site www.ciaran-tobin.com where a foundation tries to document this outrageous case...

Best regards...

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#14 [url]

Apr 30 08 8:43 PM

Hello Folks - Failte !

Best of luck to yis in seeking justice in this case - could I suggest that ye also post an article on the Indymedia site here , as it gets a lot of attention from , amongst others , journalists , and some of them might just be encouraged to delve further into this injustice -

http://www.indymedia.ie/

Best of luck ,

Slan Anois !

Ireland.

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#15 [url]

Apr 30 08 8:48 PM

bzs60 wrote:

Citation from the site www.ciaran-tobin.com :

"The case highlights Hungarian incompetency, Irish embarrassment, legal and linguistic acrobatics, and EU's ineffectiveness." So, we know that there were a lot of mistakes on the Hungarian side as well. But after all there is a sentence by the court.
Best regards...


Thanks! Hopefully you don't think I was trying to justify the actions of this man or the so-called Irish Government... I most certainly was not.

Bye for now.

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Kat

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#16 [url]

May 1 08 3:34 AM

I read the website you linked to, it seems shocking that the irish government is not holding him responsible to serve a tiny 3 year sentence. Best of luck with your campaign

out of curiousity, were his wife and child injured?

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